Entry tags:
"NIRVANA IN FIRE"/"LANG YA BANG" GROUP READ: DISCUSSION POST FOR CHAPTERS 34 - 37
Week 9 of the "Lang Ya Bang" book club, chapters 34 - 37. This discussion will draw to a close, and the next session will open, on July 4th.
I'll be doing a weekly post with thoughts on this community. Feel free to join in/discuss. If you'd like to join the Discord, contact![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
superborb for an invite.
Chinese text: https://sj.uukanshu.com/book.aspx?id=17338
English translation: https://merelhyn.tumblr.com/post/641747965727358976/the-langya-list-epubpdf
SPOILER POLICY: I personally don't give a fuck or even like to give unearned credence to the concept, so since I'm writing the post, anything's fair game.
(If anyone is interested in![[community profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/community.png)
dankodes running further poetry content during or after NiF, please let me know what you'd be keen to discuss. I'm happy to work with you on that. I'll probably ask this again once NiF draws to a close.)
I'll be doing a weekly post with thoughts on this community. Feel free to join in/discuss. If you'd like to join the Discord, contact
superborb for an invite.Chinese text: https://sj.uukanshu.com/book.aspx?id=17338
English translation: https://merelhyn.tumblr.com/post/641747965727358976/the-langya-list-epubpdf
SPOILER POLICY: I personally don't give a fuck or even like to give unearned credence to the concept, so since I'm writing the post, anything's fair game.
(If anyone is interested in
dankodes running further poetry content during or after NiF, please let me know what you'd be keen to discuss. I'm happy to work with you on that. I'll probably ask this again once NiF draws to a close.)
Chapter 34
People are always loosing teeth in these things! Well I am here to tell you, after the Toast Incident, that this is no joke, and not a light matter for a one-sentence dismissal--
Thinking about it, if Changsu starts off NOT knowing about his Aunt Liyang's past and thus Jingrui's actual parentage, does that mean a lot of the Birthday Party is a plot he makes from Chang'An? Like, a pretty recent development/response to what he learns here? Kind of harsher to do it while knowing Jingrui as a person again/after his aunt starts to reveal her secrets willingly in an emergency.
Oh, green for poison again.
'the events of the past are like a mountain buried deep in thick snow' I mean literally in this case
Re: Chapter 34
On page 257, the start of the prevent Nihuang from drinking the wine arc, we learn Princess Liyang used to be a fiery young woman and at some point became cold and unapproachable. The text makes it clear that Mei Changsu's investigation did not turn up when or why this happened.
On page 261, after learning of the wine, Mei Changsu asks who the Empress Dowager could have disapproved of so completely that she used the wine. When Princess Liyang replies that it was a hostage prince sent from Southern Chu, we get this: Mei Changsu’s confusions cleared immediately. This could be read that 1) he immediately understands why the Empress Dowager so disapproved of the man, or that 2) he already knows who Jingrui's father is and her story just filled in some of the background for him.
I think the most potent argument that he already knew is Miss Gongyu's presence in the city. Granted she's part of his spy network, but I think the main reason she's there is to reveal information at Jingrui's birthday. The poison wine arc had been finished in the previous chapter; we don't know how much later this is, but Yujin says he hasn't been to Miaoyin house in a long time and that Miss Gongyu must be missing him. This suggests that Miss Gongyu was in the city before Princess Liyang visited Mei Changsu. Doesn't prove it though.
Re: Chapter 34
Re: Chapter 34
Atlas Obscura has an interesting article.
Chapter 35
Why are there spectators to the written test, what's to see? Let the guys concentrate and write essays, sheesh.
When would 'Sir Su' ever have seen Prince Jing's training grounds?
this is an interesting observation from Jingrui, re: MCS hasn't changed much, it's him who wants more open closeness (though Yujin is also a bit of a layered bullshitter who plays a Peter Wimsey haplessness to cover acuity, so shouldn't Jingrui be used to these kinds of fronts by now?) Jingrui's resignation about MCS post Birthday Party was, for me, one of the most unusual and striking elements of the drama--a way of thinking about interpersonal relationships that seemed novel and well-considered. You get hints of it here, in Jingrui's deciding to like Changsu for what their relationship is, not what he wishes it would be.
I don't actually read Jingrui's draw towards Changsu as necessarily romantic? There's an energy to it that certainly could be that, but (and this is just a personal reading) I don't really want to circumscribe the weird mixture of semi-conscious nostalgia for lost older relatives (Lin Shu himself, the old crown prince, Jing before he was a bitter effective-exile on the frontier), admiration and sense that this man is hiding something and say--yeah, it's *definitively* romantic. Attraction/a crush is possibly a component here, tied in with these other drives--the lesbian 'to I want to be with her or be her?' muddle. If I were reading this on my own though, like in some random historical novel of manners/outside of a fandom context, I wouldn't necessarily understand this as attraction. (I mean for the sake of fairness I acknowledge that's not a ship I'm at all interested in, which is colouring my reading, sure.) Plus there's Jingrui's declared interest in a woman, and then whatever his long association with Yujin amounts to--and I know we're in a poly historical era, but does the novel really act that way? There's not a lot of poly IN the text, even when there reasonably ought to be, besides the Emperor. I guess Yujin likes Miss G as well as maybe Jingrui... it's like you're allowed a girl and a guy interest. x_x
They don't need to tl Xia Dong as 'his', esp given that I suspect that's not the implication in Chinese. Use their if you need to!
Interesting that the Langya Lists are always 'wrong' because they're forbidden from including the Xuanjing officers therein.
tl doesn't really know what to do with the snow/clear dew passage.
That's interesting about 'both hands', I wouldn't have guessed it. Is this still a thing? Like, is it rude to hand someone a dish one-handed?
Re: Chapter 35
It seems weird that people went to gawk at Mei Changsu, but it does explain why Xia Dong was let in without being announced. It also prepares the reader for the fight with Fei Liu as he's shown tossing out those visitors who get too close.
When would 'Sir Su' ever have seen Prince Jing's training grounds? Oh, yeah, the red sand on Jingrui's shoes. I made a joke about it being a Sherlock Holmes type detail, but it appears even more so if he never, as Sir Su, had reason to be there.
My ace/aro self also doesn't see the romance.
“You are either a refined and elegant scholar, or a shrewd and sophisticated strategist, This cracks me up because I think he's really both.
Re: Chapter 35
Chapter 36
Oh yeah, this is Nihuang's new book!lover interest who's not in the drama for reasons of narrative economy, okay.
Oh is this 'drinking toasts for someone' thing what happens in the MDZS banquet scene?
This is really interesting attention to like, grief, work and expectation and how those play out with women.
I don't really like Royal Prince as a tl choice for this? If you need to gloss it because it's a distinction that makes no sense in English, and it's a title... at that point just go with Pinyin.
'and has not made a single mistake to this day' girl that--is never how it is
In a way we can see Jingyan's service as building up a strong alternative power-base, which perhaps the Emperor should be a bit more wary of. The common people know and like Jingyan because they've ever seen him/he's very active and competent. The military loves his ass.
Oh Xia Jiang is living in retirement in this? That's interesting. Takes him out of direct circulation.
The tl of this 'the loyal may not be loyal' paragraph is kind of clunky.
Re: Chapter 36
Re: Chapter 36
Re: Chapter 36
Chapter 37
Can a torch really detect--what even is the air pollution issue Changsu is describing, in modern terms?
Why does Jingrui go down instead of Yujin?
I hope Jingrui took off his expensive outer robes first!
There's grass down there? And how BIG is this stupid well??
Re: Chapter 37
Interesting that the boys didn't stay to be interrogated by the magistrates.
Re: Chapter 37